Curse

Thanas · Jul 27, 2005, 02:44 PM // 14:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Dracnor

I really hate it when people or ANet say "The game is about skill, not hours played."

Yeah, way to contradict yourselves. You gain skill by playing for a long time, the longer you play the more skilled you become, so the game IS about hours played. You can't just become "skilled" with only a few days gameplay behind you.

Also nerfing farming so much for fair players is only aiding the botting factories, those people are experts and can just find a new spot to farm much easier than normal players. And the more normal people who are denied farming, the more people who can't make money by themselves, so they turn to the bot factory companies who sell cash for RL money which creates more demand and success for the bot companies.

/signed

I'm sorry but your arguments are incredibly backwards. Somehow I don't think increasing the number of farmable areas will deter botters. Also I think you've failed to grasp the fact that the skill based nature of the game does in fact help to close the gap between causal and hardcore gamers. If you make a game item based then in order to compete with other players you must have items similar or on par with theirs. This is due to the fact that the items do indeed make a huge difference to play. Take Diablo 2 for instance. Such games give rise to UBER items, which are neccesary if you wish to compete with others. However these items are incredibly difficult to get. That is to say you must be a hardcore player to acquire them and thus compete. This sort of game is no place for the casual gamer. However utilising a system based on skills, where items do very little to change your character i.e. they are for ascetics more than anything, you are able to compete with others. This is due to the fact that most skills are balanced. That is to say there is no combination of skills which is "UBER". So even with very few skills, e.g. early on in the game, you can compete effectively. It is the utilisation of skills that matters!

Guild Master · Jul 27, 2005, 02:52 PM // 14:52

/signed

Normally, I wouldn't sign these kinds of petitions. But I'm sorry, Arenanet, getting rid of drops that can help beginners is insanity.

Melkor of ZoSo · Jul 27, 2005, 04:09 PM // 16:09

I have to say... I DO get more drops when in a party, which isn't right.

From Prima's Strategy Guide :
"Rare (gold) drops...well, you weren't expecting them to fall off the easiest monsters in the area, were you? There are one to three rare drops in an area, and if you want to find them, go after the highest monsters"

This guide was written when the game came out

Anything changed?

I know the game's always changing... but c'mon... It's now ONE Rare drop every one-to-three times you clear an Area! If that!

Thanas, you seem to be the ONLY person who got more than 3k coming out of Pre-Searing. I left as a level 8 and had 1.5k, and I thought I did a good job of squeezing everything out of it. You're on the extreme end of the Casual Gamer spectrum. The game should be targeted at neither Casual Gamers, nor Excesive Farming players. There SHOULD be AT LEAST ONE Rare drop per area, every area. Of course the drops get better as the areas get tougher, but I think that should be the rule. MOST people Don't like to take it as slow as you, Thanas. And likewise, MOST people don't like to go super fast and farm as soon as they can. We're just hearing from the farmers because we're the ones that want to take an active role in the game, and care about our drops being taken.

Thanas · Jul 27, 2005, 04:19 PM // 16:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by sparks

/signed

hey I have posted about the noobs like me buying the game and finding out how disadvantaged I was compared to all the people who have been playing and already got great armor and weapons and such. in an email to anet about this they told me to take it to their forums they didn't care one bit about what I had to say on the subject.

SO I decided to hit them where it hurt...I started ad campaign to friends, family and everyone I could to NOT buy this game untill this was fixed..
SO FAR I have convinced 18 people NOT to buy this game.
I told their marketing department what I was doing and they told me if I put out anything that they felt was damaging to their business they would sue me.

WHAT A BUNCH OF A##HOLES...whoops 22 now and counting

just my opinion of them and their nerfs...
ever heard of beta testing and balance before selling something
oh I guess we get to pay you to beta test the damn thing.

sparks

Where is the moderator? Can you please remove this post from the forum.

Sparks, you are talking nonense. Firstly this game is not based on items but skills. So it doesn't really matter that other people have better armour etc. Such items have very little effect. As for unbalanced, what are you talking about?? Other games of the MMPORG genre are incredibly unbalanced when it comes to PvP. The only way to reach the level of other players is to say goodbye to your social life.

The skill system is the most intricate I've seen in any game. There are several trillion skill combinations one may have. You ever tried to QA a game where theres several trillion skills sets to balance and pulled off something which is pretty close to perfect? What was that?? ..... No. Oh, I see.

With regards to updates, so what if they change the game. The fact that ANet read the forums and consider peoples opinions means they wish to try and accomadate players. The process of meeting everyones needs will take a while and yes not everyones needs will be met, but this is always the case with any product. With customer input, the game will eventually reach the point where it is near perfect. You should note that updates don't always deal with bugs, but also bring new player features.

And have you ever heard of Patching????

Take your comments elsewhere please. They are not wanted. You are both rude and ignorant, thus your posts will have no worth in my eyes.

Thanas · Jul 27, 2005, 04:34 PM // 16:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melkor of ZoSo

I have to say... I DO get more drops when in a party, which isn't right.

From Prima's Strategy Guide :
"Rare (gold) drops...well, you weren't expecting them to fall off the easiest monsters in the area, were you? There are one to three rare drops in an area, and if you want to find them, go after the highest monsters"

This guide was written when the game came out

Anything changed?

I know the game's always changing... but c'mon... It's now ONE Rare drop every one-to-three times you clear an Area! If that!

Thanas, you seem to be the ONLY person who got more than 3k coming out of Pre-Searing. I left as a level 8 and had 1.5k, and I thought I did a good job of squeezing everything out of it. You're on the extreme end of the Casual Gamer spectrum. The game should be targeted at neither Casual Gamers, nor Excesive Farming players. There SHOULD be AT LEAST ONE Rare drop per area, every area. Of course the drops get better as the areas get tougher, but I think that should be the rule. MOST people Don't like to take it as slow as you, Thanas. And likewise, MOST people don't like to go super fast and farm as soon as they can. We're just hearing from the farmers because we're the ones that want to take an active role in the game, and care about our drops being taken.

Just to let you know I'm not a casual gamer. I play the game a fair bit and I do fine without farming. I left pre-searing at level 9 with a lot of gold. I'm not the only person either, since the post where you read this statement was in reply to someone who was claiming someones elses post about getting 3k to be a rarity. If you'd care to read my previous posts you will find that it is excessive farming which Anet are against. They say they will rectify the farming situation in time. However these changes will be to aid those who farm within reason. I think you will find that most people here wish to farm excessively and have argued with me when I point out Anet will not allow it. And with good reason too.

BurningPants · Jul 27, 2005, 04:39 PM // 16:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by sparks

/signed

hey I have posted about the noobs like me buying the game and finding out how disadvantaged I was compared to all the people who have been playing and already got great armor and weapons and such. in an email to anet about this they told me to take it to their forums they didn't care one bit about what I had to say on the subject.

SO I decided to hit them where it hurt...I started ad campaign to friends, family and everyone I could to NOT buy this game untill this was fixed..
SO FAR I have convinced 18 people NOT to buy this game.
I told their marketing department what I was doing and they told me if I put out anything that they felt was damaging to their business they would sue me.

WHAT A BUNCH OF A##HOLES...whoops 22 now and counting

just my opinion of them and their nerfs...
ever heard of beta testing and balance before selling something
oh I guess we get to pay you to beta test the damn thing.

sparks

Yeah sure, make a new character and he is instantley level 20 without 1.5k armor, way to suck the challenge out of the game. You don't have to grind at all to get to level 20 and get the best armor. Ofcourse I am under the impression that you want to actually play the whole game and enjoy it. Sorry no cheat codes here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Dracnor

I really hate it when people or ANet say "The game is about skill, not hours played."

Yeah, way to contradict yourselves. You gain skill by playing for a long time, the longer you play the more skilled you become, so the game IS about hours played. You can't just become "skilled" with only a few days gameplay behind you.

Also nerfing farming so much for fair players is only aiding the botting factories, those people are experts and can just find a new spot to farm much easier than normal players. And the more normal people who are denied farming, the more people who can't make money by themselves, so they turn to the bot factory companies who sell cash for RL money which creates more demand and success for the bot companies.

/signed

How are you supposed to gain skill if you don't play. The idea is that you can move at your own pace without worrying about being outclassed by somoene simply because they spent HOURS GETTING SPECIAL ITEMS. Ofcourse people will abuse the game like this, but luckily it doesn't ruin your gameplay experience. Once you've played through the game once you can instantly make a pvp character and continue to enjoy the game. ANet wouldn't give you all the skills right away. They expect for you to play a few hours so that you can atleast enjoy it a bit.

By your logic you shouldn't play any game. All games require some level of skill meaning that you need to spend some time getting skilled. ANet wants to minimize the amount of time players spend grinding and farming and want to maximize the the amount of time players and can enjoy the game without being rushed or being forced to fine good items.

Melkor of ZoSo · Jul 27, 2005, 04:40 PM // 16:40

I didnt mean to offend you in any way, Thanas, if the last part of your post was directed towards me. My prior post was in a calm tone

Bizarro_Jesus · Jul 27, 2005, 05:18 PM // 17:18

So, I'm a totally new person to this game. Infact, this is my first MMORPG.

I'm currently at Lion's gate, with a level 16 W/N and I rarely (RARELY) get anything worthy of mention. Perhaps a crude purple shield or a "Flatbow of Uselessness". What really irks me is how most of what I get can't be used by my character. So, I made other characaters who all now share inventory. Meaning my Ranger/Mesmer has a really great bow to start out in the Ruins of Asacalon.

As far as actual gold goes, I don't really see a problem. I asked one of my guildies how to make money they said "salvage every thing you can", horde it up and sell it off. So far that's made me a fair amout of money.

There is definitely a problem, however, because when I go solo in any area, I get hardly anything, next to 0 drops. But when I go out with a party with actual players (in a mission, no less) everyone got drops BUT me. We did "Frost Gate" and I got 0 drops for the whole mission. So, I did it again, but with henchmen only and I got 4 drops. Weird? I'd say so.

But I'm not going to cry and whine about it. My guildies have been so nice and generous to me, that's my main suggestion. Get into a quality guild with people who are willing to farm with you or help you find what you need. I never asked them to give me a flamberge (max damage) but only where I could find one (or buy) and my buddy just GAVE me one.

So, I think ANET is trying to get people to guild up and things of the like. They're forcing players to create a community, which isn't really that bad, afterall.

Of course, I could be a complete idiot who has no bearing of intelligible thought.

Yeprem · Jul 27, 2005, 06:03 PM // 18:03

/Signed

2-3 days ago was the first time I really needed to get my hands on some gold. I tried to do a couple of runs. No chance in hell to get what you need in a decent amount of time. I don't want to play for 10-11 hours to get the gold I need. My time is worth more than the 7$ it costs to get something on eBay. Something to consider. Might use a "Buy it now" in a few days.

Thanas · Jul 27, 2005, 06:46 PM // 18:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melkor of ZoSo

I didnt mean to offend you in any way, Thanas, if the last part of your post was directed towards me. My prior post was in a calm tone

I also assumed that tone

. Just trying to explain that most people here wish to make excessive farming acceptable. Personally I think this will ruin the game.

JoDiamonds · Jul 27, 2005, 07:27 PM // 19:27

I disagree. Keep the game and economy balance fixes coming, Arena.

plouyd · Jul 27, 2005, 07:33 PM // 19:33

ok i dont know what your talking about.. hard to get rich? are u serious ;O.. i found a 5:1 vampiric longbow, farming MERGOYLES.. ya those level 14 things. Sold that for 60k, then made anouther 60k that day in UW!(ecto's) then th e next day i foud like 5 more so i dunno what your talking about

the bloodthirst · Jul 27, 2005, 08:05 PM // 20:05

i dont know why some ppl are so against ppl farming. Farming doesnt hurt you or anyone else. the fact that Anet is nerfing it is ridiculous. Sure you can find rare items in groups. I never get them though because they are always reserved for other players. Dont direct this game totally to pvp. This is a mmorpg if i am not mistaken. it is a role playing game. i should be able to play the game how i want to play it not how Anet wants me to play it. give us the farming spots back. i dont know much of how to farm in this game considering that i am fairly new. But i know what the meaning is and i say if you nerf it then this game is no longer an rpg.

Vito Genovese · Jul 27, 2005, 08:13 PM // 20:13

/signed

Commodore_Mcawesome · Jul 27, 2005, 08:20 PM // 20:20

Sorry for the length of this, but I just have to say my peace.

Lets look at a situation here, it should look pretty familiar:

1. People farm for items and money and get plenty of both
2. ANet puts a stop to farming
3. People have plenty of items and money already, so everything's cool.
4. New people come and have neither of these things.
5. New people can't farm and thus stay poor.
6. Old people trade items amongst themselves for ungodly prices because they are the only one's that can afford it and thus stay more or less rich.

So the new people are staying poor and the old are staying rich. Boy oh boy, it looks like we've created an economic aristocracy, and a static market to boot!

Solutions:

1. Make everyone rich (allow farming)
2. Make everyone poor (gold sinks, or some such method)
3. Provide the means to allow people to become either rich or poor by their own means. (Farming and Gold Sinks respectively)

And don't TALK to me about going to the Hall of Campers for money. I don't much enjoy sitting and spamming " Protection Monk LFG, and no I don't have TS or Ventrilo because it makes me lag since I'm on 56k. As such, please only invite me if you're a PUG that has no idea how to PvP and will never see the Hall in their lifetime. " Or maybe I could just go with my guild! Who never has anyone on at any time! And even if I could get them together, and even if we COULD somehow beat all the other teams (that's a big if, mind you), then I'm guaranteed to walk out of there with a sigil right? Don't make me laugh...

As for those saying that farmers aren't accepting any of the genius ideas that have been presented in this thread, maybe it's because these don't actually WORK, more than we're all just stubborn and believe farming is the only thing that will redeem us. If you think that getting money is so simple, then would you care to explain the 4-5 threads per day in just about every GW related forum that contains some new guy trying to make some money so he can afford his armor?! Yeah, you're right, we're all just too lazy too go out and make money without exploiting the game by killing monsters for it.

/signed

IronChefMorimoto · Jul 27, 2005, 08:22 PM // 20:22

I'm a new user -- still only a level 11, and I'm pretty far back in the game from what I can tell (I've been rushing through levels rather stupidly).

I'm so new to MMORPGs that I had to look up what "farming" was before I came in here to post my comment. As a new user, I'd think that many of you would be interested in comments such as mine. Most of you who have signed off in favor of the "petition" have made comments about how this "nerfing" of areas must be driving off new players. Let me say this -- I'm not sure I could sign this petition, but I'm also not sure I could go without signing it.

On the one hand, I HATE being spammed from high level advanced players to BUY something from them. I would assume that, to some degree, "farmers" do this. Frankly, as a new player, I feel like a newb enough already without having 40-50 WTS/RARE ITEM messages popping up in 2-3 minutes. It makes me feel, as a new player, like I'm totally out of my element and will have to deal with "farmers" or "botters" who have gotten their own copies of the really rare stuff to sell.

Plus, it takes the adventure out of finding the sh*t on my own -- isn't that the point of the game? To enjoy the adventure along with the community? I have no interest in forming a guild just to be able to pool money to afford things that I need to survive the adventures later on the game. Sh*t -- I pool money now with my wife to be able to pay our f*cking mortgage. I don't need to be doing it in a damned video game.

On the other hand, I will say that the "nerfing," based on comments here, has affected my initial impression of the game. I understand why AreaNet might be doing it -- f*cking high level players mooching off newbs like me who can't get any farther without some decent equipment. Christ -- it's a game -- not a chance to live out a mafia fantasy life of extortion. I swear, some of the people selling might as well have Warrior/Monks standing around named Tony, Louis, and Richie to kick my ass if I don't buy.

However, just without even having read this forum, I have to admit -- it's hard as sh*t to buy stuff. Getting 11 gold here or there in a 2-player group is OK, but that's split 2 ways -- that's insane, given that runes (according to the assanine rune trader in Ascalon) run f*cking 74K gold. It's nuts. And if I had known more about this whole game before I bought it, I'd have seriously reconsidered investing $50 of REAL f*cking money in it and REAL f*cking time if I'd known I'd have to beg for items.

Someone made reference to Diablo 2 as having been screwed up LONG before this game. I love this game -- it's Diablo V as far as I'm concerned -- so good. But, if I find that I can't move forward or enjoy the adventures because I'm on f*cking GW welfare checks, then I'm gonna start reading books again for entertainment.

Give the "farmers" more to do after level 20 so they won't have to farm and ruin the game for newbs like me, and THEN get the damned economy fixed so newbs like me don't have to panhandle for swords. Otherwise, Ascalon will soon be filled with GW homeless -- holding signs (given that we can spend time designing dumbass capes for guilds) that read "Will quest for food or rare items."

My 2 cents.

IronChefMorimoto

Bragg Madaxe · Jul 27, 2005, 08:23 PM // 20:23

How about like a farming hour-randomly choose hours in the day when farming is back for an hour only. You'd only know about it through a log in announcement or something. Hit or miss. At least you could do it every now and then...
/signed

Paul Templar · Jul 27, 2005, 08:24 PM // 20:24

Just increase the number of drops in missions etc and with teams
so these farming bots wont have anywhere to farm and decrease the number of drops for solos as bots farm solo
Evens it out abit and allows for more people willing to do mission knowing that is where the drops are
end of story

prodigy ming · Jul 27, 2005, 09:55 PM // 21:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronChefMorimoto

I'm a new user -- still only a level 11, and I'm pretty far back in the game from what I can tell (I've been rushing through levels rather stupidly).

I'm so new to MMORPGs that I had to look up what "farming" was before I came in here to post my comment. As a new user, I'd think that many of you would be interested in comments such as mine. Most of you who have signed off in favor of the "petition" have made comments about how this "nerfing" of areas must be driving off new players. Let me say this -- I'm not sure I could sign this petition, but I'm also not sure I could go without signing it.

On the one hand, I HATE being spammed from high level advanced players to BUY something from them. I would assume that, to some degree, "farmers" do this. Frankly, as a new player, I feel like a newb enough already without having 40-50 WTS/RARE ITEM messages popping up in 2-3 minutes. It makes me feel, as a new player, like I'm totally out of my element and will have to deal with "farmers" or "botters" who have gotten their own copies of the really rare stuff to sell.

Plus, it takes the adventure out of finding the sh*t on my own -- isn't that the point of the game? To enjoy the adventure along with the community? I have no interest in forming a guild just to be able to pool money to afford things that I need to survive the adventures later on the game. Sh*t -- I pool money now with my wife to be able to pay our f*cking mortgage. I don't need to be doing it in a damned video game.

On the other hand, I will say that the "nerfing," based on comments here, has affected my initial impression of the game. I understand why AreaNet might be doing it -- f*cking high level players mooching off newbs like me who can't get any farther without some decent equipment. Christ -- it's a game -- not a chance to live out a mafia fantasy life of extortion. I swear, some of the people selling might as well have Warrior/Monks standing around named Tony, Louis, and Richie to kick my ass if I don't buy.

However, just without even having read this forum, I have to admit -- it's hard as sh*t to buy stuff. Getting 11 gold here or there in a 2-player group is OK, but that's split 2 ways -- that's insane, given that runes (according to the assanine rune trader in Ascalon) run f*cking 74K gold. It's nuts. And if I had known more about this whole game before I bought it, I'd have seriously reconsidered investing $50 of REAL f*cking money in it and REAL f*cking time if I'd known I'd have to beg for items.

Someone made reference to Diablo 2 as having been screwed up LONG before this game. I love this game -- it's Diablo V as far as I'm concerned -- so good. But, if I find that I can't move forward or enjoy the adventures because I'm on f*cking GW welfare checks, then I'm gonna start reading books again for entertainment.

Give the "farmers" more to do after level 20 so they won't have to farm and ruin the game for newbs like me, and THEN get the damned economy fixed so newbs like me don't have to panhandle for swords. Otherwise, Ascalon will soon be filled with GW homeless -- holding signs (given that we can spend time designing dumbass capes for guilds) that read "Will quest for food or rare items."

My 2 cents.

IronChefMorimoto

take a chill pill pal and stop trying to swear bewteen every two words. The game is no where near how you describe it.... if as you say, the point of this game is adventure and exploring, they you don't need any uber equipment from old players to advance. therefore you can simply ignore the trade channel. No one is forcing you to buy from them. I played through the game the first time without buying a single thing from another player and it was still fine and fun. If you think the drop sux then just sign it....

JoDiamonds · Jul 27, 2005, 09:56 PM // 21:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by the bloodthirst

This is a mmorpg if i am not mistaken.

You are mistaken.

http://www.guildwars.com/faq/default.html :

Quote:

Rather than labeling Guild Wars an MMORPG, we prefer to call it a CORPG (Competitive Online Role-Playing Game).

At least, that's what Arena Net officially calls it.